so german leftists thinks its okay to kill children to occupy foreign soil (palestine) and that israel should not withdraw to their original borders.. hmmm they sounds like the far r ight in norway then..

so german leftists thinks its okay to kill children to occupy foreign soil (palestine) and that israel should not withdraw to their original borders.. hmmm they sounds like the far r ight in norway then..

i agree to what madhatterz said however you should take into account that the only real fascists are on the israeli support list.. namely the IDF, and ofcourse hamas is pretty fascist too but hamas dont represent the whole of palestinian people their a religious fanatical militant group that dreams of creating a islamic fascist state.
all in all there is no justification for israelis to massacre palestinians and starve them and hold them in prison the only non fascist option for israel is to withdraw all their forces back to the original borders of israel and end occupation and leave it up to palestinians themselves to buyild their society.. also any proper anarchist would never support a state like israel which is build on apartheid then again no anarchist would give their support to any state whatever its ideologic is.

fake article! the german antifascist groups indeed boycott the protests, as Hamas and Hisbullah flags are shown and the demonstrators repeatedly shouted "death to israel". The translated comments are propaganda against the german antifascist and antiracist antifa movement, that is fighting against antisemitism. no german antifa is so stupid and nazilike, that he wants dead palestinians. this is stupid propaganda of german israel-haters.

As long as "solidarity" demonstrations in Germany are mostly made of NPD nazis waving palastinian flags and hisbollah or hamas muslim maniacs, blaming the jews for all evil in the world, why should German anti-fascists or other leftists attend those demonstrations? The moment the people in Gaza decide to send the Hamas assholes and their rockets to hell, then it is time to demonstrate for the immediate withdrawal of the IDF.

Please take into account that german imc is also read by nazis and other dumb idiots and the commentary function is usually abused by some people. Take into account that german left wing has been long time completely pro palestine, anti Israel (probably just because of the fact that Israel is a state (which means on a left-anarchist definition basis that it must be evil by default) while "the palestinians" have been seen as the poor, good, working-class, fighting with stones against nuclear weapons (speaking literarely of course)). In the past ten years or so there has been big discussion about that in the radical left. Of course german antifascists are frightened of beeing called antisemitic. Of course somebody calling themselve antifascist could not attend a demonstration with people who would like to see Israel removed from the map the sooner the better. We would not want to have a demonstration with Nazis against the EU government either.

here in the US, even the jewish anti-zionist groups are not endorsing the demonstrations. the openly pro-Hamas and antisemitic content of the calls of the demonstrations are keeping everyone away - as well as their failure to condemn the rocket attacks. The US Palestine Solidarity movement here has made it known that unless you openly call to dissolve Israel AND also accept antisemitism in the criticism of Israel, you are not welcome to work with them anymore. Therefore they can only raise coalitions with hardline Marxist-Leninists and orthodox Muslim groups like CAIR. It is no surprise that the German groups are staying away.

I don't see how this situation benefits the residents of Gaza, but sometimes I think the Palestine Solidarity movement here is not about helping Palestinians, but only about hating Israel as an end in itself. Sad days for everyone.

Die „Antinationalen” und die Zionisten

Die „Antinationalen“ sind im Wesentlichen eine deutsche Erscheinung. Ihr Rassismus und ihre Hetze gegen die Linke entsprechen den Absichten der SPD/Grünen-Regierung des deutschen Imperialismus, gegen die Linke und ethnische Minderheiten vorzugehen. Ihre offene Unterstützung des US-geführten Kriegs gegen den Irak geht konform mit einem Flügel der deutschen Bourgeoisie, der der Meinung ist, dass der deutsche Imperialismus vorerst nicht zu sehr auf Distanz zu seinem amerikanischen Rivalen gehen sollte. In diesem Zusammenhang steht auch die enge Verbindung der „Antinationalen“ zur erzkonservativen Springer-Presse, die genau diesen Flügel der deutschen Bourgeoisie vertritt. So sprechen Vertreter der reaktionären Springer-Zeitung Die Welt auf „antinationalen“ Konferenzen, und so wird in der „antinationalen“ Presse Die Welt gelobt.

Die „Antinationalen“ kollaborieren auch eng mit einer Reihe zionistischer Organisationen. Vom 6. bis 8. September 2002 veranstaltete die „antinationale“ Jungle World einen Kongress zum 11. September. Dieser Kongress wurde mitgetragen von MEMRI – das Middle East Media Research Institute. Wie der britische Journalist Brian Whitaker vom Guardian in seinem Artikel „Selective MEMRI“ (12. August 2002) recherchierte – versorgt MEMRI weltweit Presseagenturen mit hochwertigen Übersetzungen aus der arabischen Presse. Whitaker schrieb: „Die Storys, die von MEMRI zur Übersetzung ausgewählt werden, folgen einem bekannten Muster: Entweder geben sie ein schlechtes Bild vom Charakter der Araber wider oder sie fördern in irgendeiner Weise die politische Agenda Israels. Ich habe dieses Unbehagen nicht allein.“ MEMRI wird geleitet von einem gewissen Jigal Carmon, der 22 Jahre lang im israelischen Militärgeheimdienst arbeitete und Terrorismus-Berater von Jitzhak Shamir und Jitzhak Rabin war. Drei der sechs Mitarbeiter, die auf MEMRIs Homepage vorgestellt wurden – diese Liste wurde inzwischen von der Homepage gelöscht –, sind ehemalige Mitarbeiter des israelischen Geheimdiensts. Mitbegründerin von MEMRI war Meyrav Wurmser, die mit Richard Perle, dem Vorsitzenden des Verteidigungsausschusses des Pentagon und Berater für George Bush, im Hudson Institute eng zusammenarbeitet. Die linke ehemals maoistische Zeitung analyse kritik beschrieb MEMRI so: „Das Memri ist ganz eindeutig nicht nur erklärtermaßen pro-israelisch … sondern es orientiert sich an der Politik des Likud, und zwar noch am ehesten an dessen rechtem Flügel um Netanjahu. Das Memri bekämpft einen friedlichen Ausgleich mit den Palästinensern. Und es ist eng verflochten mit dem neokonservativen Netzwerk, das die Strategie eines ‚Vierten Weltkriegs‘ gegen den ‚militanten Islam‘ propagiert“ (ak, 17. Januar 2003).

Enge Kollaboration zwischen „Antinationalen“ und Zionisten gibt es auch im Berliner Anti-Defamation Forum (ADF). Auf dessen Homepage findet man sämtliche „antinationale“ Demo-Aufrufe, einschließlich der Provokation gegen die Demonstration von Palästinensern in Berlin am 27. September. Das ADF ist der deutsche Ableger der amerikanischen Anti Defamation League (ADL), die selbst eine finstere Geschichte hat. Zusammen mit dem American Jewish Committee setzte sich die ADL-Vorgängerorganisation B‘nai B‘rith 1933 gegen den Aufruf zur Öffnung der Grenzen der Vereinigten Staaten für Flüchtlinge vom Nazi-Terror ein. Die ADL sprach sich ausdrücklich gegen Massenproteste gegen die Nazi-Pogromnacht 1938 aus. Heute agiert die ADL in Amerika als eine Gedankenpolizei für den Krieg des israelischen Regimes gegen „PLO-Terrorismus“, indem sie auf heuchlerische Weise die Unterstützung amerikanischer Linker für arabischen Nationalismus benutzt und Antizionismus mit Antisemitismus gleichsetzt. Im Berliner ADF gehörten letztes Jahr zu den Kuratoriumsmitgliedern unter anderem die CDU-Mitglieder Barbara John, Michel Friedman und außerdem Nils Busch-Petersen (Hauptgeschäftsführer des Berliner Einzelhandelsverbandes, der am 14. Dezember 2002 das Verbot einer Anti-Kriegs-Demonstration auf dem Berliner Kurfürstendamm erwirkte).

Das ADF war Unterstützer des Aufrufs für die Provokation gegen die Berliner Demonstration „Palästina muss leben“ im April 2002. Alle „antinationalen“ Gruppen versammelten sich an diesem Tag, um unter dem Motto „Solidarität mit Israel“ eine Konfrontation mit palästinensischen Demonstranten zu provozieren.

Stoppt die Angriffe der „Antinationalen“ auf Linke und Palästinenser!

Es ist auffällig, dass „Antinationale“ sich Zugang zu ASten und Studentenparlamenten verschaffen, indem sie ihre Leute auf offene linke Wahllisten setzen. Die ASten der Unis in Berlin, Duisburg, Potsdam, Hannover, Göttingen, München und anderen Städten sind zu Organisierungszentren der „Antinationalen“ geworden, und linke Uni-Gruppen werden dort systematisch eingeschüchtert, bedroht und auch physisch angegriffen. Dabei verwalten die „Antinationalen“ auch nicht geringe Beträge an Staatsgeldern, um ihre rassistischen Kongresse an Unis abzuhalten. Die „antinationale“ Gruppe „liberté toujours“, die zur Provokation gegen die Berliner Palästina-Demo am 27. September mit aufrief, hat ihre Postadresse beim AStA der Humboldt-Uni. Die HUmmel-Antifa des AStA der Humboldt-Uni rief in einem eigenen Aufruf „Gegen die ‚achse des friedens‘“ dazu auf, mit allen Mitteln die Demonstration von Palästinensern und Kriegsgegnern zu verhindern.

Aber die „Antinationalen“ nutzen ihre Positionen in den ASten auch, um die Organisierung und Durchführung von Protesten gegen die staatlichen Angriffe auf Bildung und gegen die Einführung von Studiengebühren zu behindern. Zum Beispiel fand am 18. und 19. September an der Berliner Humboldt-Uni das Europäische Bildungsforum statt mit dem Ziel, europaweit Proteste gegen Bildungsabbau zu koordinieren und gleichzeitig gegen die Konferenz der europäischen Bildungsminister in Berlin zu protestieren. Der „antinationale“ AStA hatte den Organisatoren dieser Veranstaltung Unterstützung zugesagt, was im Wesentlichen darauf hinauslief, Räume und andere Logistik an der Humboldt-Uni zur Verfügung zu stellen. Jedoch hat der AStA einen Tag vor dem Kongress bewusst jegliche Unterstützung zurückgenommen, was die Organisatoren vor massive logistische Probleme stellte. Die HUmmel-Antifa drohte Konsequenzen an, falls ein angeblich „antisemitischer“ Stand nicht entfernt würde.

Bei unserem Versuch, Linke und Gewerkschafter zu einer Einheitsfrontverteidigung gegen den Terror der „Antinationalen“ zu motivieren, stießen wir häufig auf das Argument, dass man die „Antinationalen“ am besten ignorieren solle, sonst würde man ihnen zu viel Aufmerksamkeit und Öffentlichkeit geben. Aber dieses Argument ist von Grund auf falsch. Wie wir oben bewiesen haben, sind die „Antinationalen“ kein Teil der Linken. Sie hassen Araber, sie hassen all jene, die gegen die Unterdrückung der Palästinenser kämpfen wollen, sie hassen Linke und Gewerkschaften. Eine Reihe antirassistischer und Immigrantenorganisationen berichteten uns von homophoben und frauenfeindlichen Äußerungen der „Antinationalen“. Bei „Antinationalen“ handelt es sich nicht um „Linke“, mit denen man eine falsche Politik debattieren kann. „Antinationale“ sind rassistische und antikommunistische Schläger im Dienste der kapitalistischen SPD/Grünen-Regierung, was sie durch ihre Taten bewiesen haben. Sie müssen isoliert und heraus getrieben werden aus der Linken und Arbeiterbewegung. Stoppt die Angriffe der „Antinationalen“ auf Linke und Palästinenser!
http://www.icl-fi.org/deutsch/oldsite/antinationale.html

if you live in a city like Vienna - which in 1938 had 180.000 jewish inhabitants and today has 7.500 - as an antifascist you simply cannot go to these demonstrations. There's people with signs telling you that "Olmert = Hitler" or equating the star of david with the swastika. Of course this meets well with a more traditional Austrian antisemitism that always longed to be able to identifiy jews as perpetrators. Some things look different in a post-nationalsocialist country... as for groups "hating arabs" - yes (former) left racist groups do exist, but to think that those are the majority would be giving them far too much credit.
I wish you the best for all your actions against the war and against repression!

I'd not take those comments serious. Those guys simply are more interested in drinking. Hard to face the brutality of war without getting sarcastic. The refurbishment of our nazional socials past is a double-edged thing. In general the east part never felt guily for the genozide. More reflection work has happen in the western part. So I think many of in the left wing movement simply have no clue what they are writing. They are not against wr and pro peace but agains facism.
I'm german my grandfather was in the sa an grandunlce was a communist and died in an concentration camp. Thought I had to share my view.

Things like these happen a lot around here in Germany, that is true. Those stating stuff like mentioned above belong to those who call themselves "Antideutsche", about who there is a huge debate going on in the German left. They themselves often state they do not belong to the left, neither do most of the rest of the left want them to be mentioned as "part of the left" for their obviously stupid ideas that are certainly everything but left.

Meanwhile, there is other people trying to get to know more. I habe been surfing the web for a few days now to get information from the both israeli and palestinian left about their view of things. its not that easy as i do not speak hebrew or arabian and am not really sure where to go looking. if you know some articles in english or sites i could go that might just not pop up by a simple google search, would you be so kind to let me know? im sorry mis-using indy for this but i do not know how to help myself anymore. the information is meant for people of the german left for better discussion background so its possible at least for a few to finally get to a point from which there can be useful work done.
so if u think u can help me out, please email me at
franka.karels@web.de
thanks very much in advance,
franka

No, I won't be satisfied when more Jews die. I'll be pleased, though, when some of the people, regardless of ethnicity, who give or arrange material support to the Zionist Terror Regime suffer what almost 1,000 Palestinians have suffered in the last 2 weeks at the hands of that regime.

And maybe, if enough of us were to make it clear that we are as much against Jewish racists as any Gentiles are, it would be harder for the few Muslims who have a hatred of Jews unrelated to "Israel" to get other Muslims to join in or even support bigoted anti-Jewish slogans. As it is, given the failure of most people publicly identified as Jews to speak out aginst Zionist crimes, it's totally unsurprising that victims of Zionism want to, at least vicariously, kill Jews.

"The world does not see the pain and suffering of the Israeli family"!!! In most of the world, in fact, the attention paid by the media to the suffering, on average, of each affected Israeli is overwhelmingly greater than the attention paid to the suffering of each affected Palestinian.

And there's no evidence that Hamas is using their people as "human shields", unless you would also say that your government, by allowing its civilian leaders and off-duty soldiers to spend time in civilian areas, is using the people of those areas as "human shields". Moreover, do you expect us to believe that, if the so-called "human shields" were Jews, your military would be killing them by the hundreds to stop a few rockets from being fired?

Perhaps you "dont go out there looking for innocent womaen and children to kill", but just kill anything that moves -- occasionally, but all too rarely, killing some of your own thugs in the process!

And, by the way, how many of those Israeli families in the range of Hamas rockets are actually living in areas from which the parents and grandparents of the people crammed into Gaza were "cleansed" by Zionist terror 60 years ago? The great majority, I would venture to guess!

Yes, I do understand you, and I don't like the Jewish-chauvinist racism I see.

I am a Zionist. I support the right of the Jewish people to live in peace and security AND I support the right of the Palestinian people to live in security and peace. If only they were willing to give up their desire to annihilate Israel.
I guess I'll see you on the streets of San Francisco Aaron. And if I catch you chanting "Slaughter the Jews", I'll add the video to this discussion thread. ; - )

I have suspected this for a long time

Good News
1. As of 8PM, Sunday 3/22 the following people have been released from
jail - Murad Abuh Hamdieh, Lily Haskell, Nadeen Elshorafa and Mohammed
Ibrahim! They all safely home with their family and community.

2. We have indication that up to two more people will likely be released
by later Sunday night.

3. There has been incredible out-pouring of financial support that will
likely allow us to bail everyone out within the next 24 hours.

Critical Next Steps
1. A growing group of people have come together to work on this defense
and there have been a lot of progress made in the areas of media,
communications and legal strategy. If you are interested in being a part
of any of this work please call,

2. There have been calls to various individuals in the Arab and
Palestinian community asking questions about the events surrounding the
arrests, these calls have come from the media, people representing various
organizations and political groups. Those of us working on the defense
would like to encourage anyone who was an eye witness to the events NOT to
speak to anyone at this time. Please contact, Chris at (510)206-6646, if
you have any questions at all about how to deal with these calls or to
provide information that will help our friends successful defeat these
false charges. It is critical that our communications to all sources
reflect the overall legal and communications strategy in order to best
serve the the needs of those who have been arrested. Information that is
provided without the coordination of the legal and communications teams
could SERIOUSLY affect the safety of those who have been arrested.

3. Please direct your questions to the following point people around the
areas that they are coodinating -
Maherah (maherah1218@yahoo.com) and Mai-Stella (maistella.k@gmail.com) -
Fundraising
Chris (clymbertos@hotmail.com) - Media and Communications
Rama (ramakased@gmail.com) and Marissa (marashkar@yahoo.com) - Legal Support

4. Please continue to keep those donations coming!! We need to urgently
raise money for the legal defense, so send all contributions to Maherah
Silmi at 1333 Gough Street, Apt. 1F, San Francisco, Ca 94109

PHONE BLAST INFO!

Hi my name is ____________________________

I am calling about the arrests of

Mustafa Albouyha
Majdi Abu Hamdieh
Elizabeth Haskell
Mohammed Ibrahim
Nadeen Elshorafa

These individuals were wrongfully arrested while participating in a legal,
peaceful march yesterday. We are demanding that the charges be dropped
immediately.

If you find out any update about these arrests during your call please let
us know by calling (510) 534-7933.